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  #1  
Old Tue 11 May 2010, 20:55
scot
Just call me: scot #62
 
Ft. Wayne In.
United States of America
Updated to Rack and Pinion from Chain Drive #62 - Fort Wayne, IN USA

Hello everyone! My name is Scot. I live in Fort Wayne, IN in a repurposed Firestation. We live in the top floor, and my shop is on the ground floor. I worked as a Honda mechanic for quite a few years, but recently moved the business to a building next door, and it is now being run by a friend.
I have been working on a Mechmate for several weeks now with my nephew Collin (user name cmd1991). It is for him and his Dad, and they will be using it primarily to cut cabinet parts. We have a rolling gantry and Y car so far.
I will be posting pictures and more information soon in the "Construction Started" thread.
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  #2  
Old Tue 11 May 2010, 21:39
scot
Just call me: scot #62
 
Ft. Wayne In.
United States of America
Mechmaking in Fort Wayne

I guess I will start posting a few pictures here for now.
The first one shows how we leveled our x tubing with jacks and a level.
Next we measured out our cross piece supports and welded them.

The second picture is happening because we accidently ordered our tubing the wrong length. oh well

The third picture shows our method of cutting the rails. We clamped the angle iron to the inside of our tubing, and held our grinder vertically so we could push down. We used a wood block for the base on our grinder when we started, but ended up switching to a metal one. We found it worth the time to make guards for these grinder setups

I think If we did it again, I would try the skill saw method. We went through 12 Harbor Freight cutoff discs. I wish I would have known about the perfd Inox discs. It may have been worth it. For the grinding we used 4 or 5 Aluminum oxide discs from Harbour Freight. They seemed to work very well.
Keep in mind that this is a very time consuming project. Collin spent around 4 or 5 days cutting and grinding. What a mess too.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg welding1_800x479.jpg (49.9 KB, 2773 views)
File Type: jpg table.jpg (51.9 KB, 2770 views)
File Type: jpg grinding1.jpg (55.0 KB, 2779 views)
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  #3  
Old Tue 11 May 2010, 23:45
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
Welcome Scot, have merged the posts in the Construction started section.

Last edited by Gerald D; Tue 11 May 2010 at 23:48..
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  #4  
Old Wed 12 May 2010, 16:07
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Thumbs up

Here are some pictures of the y car. We still have to make the z plate and mount the spider and all that good stuff.

We finally have a rolling gantry and Y car. Yay for Scot! I was wondering why the holes for the v bearings (on the gantry and Y car) were not 5/16" like the eccentrics? they were closer to 1/2" (We ordered the laser cut parts from cvsupply.com) Was this their fault? Scot actually drilled them out and made bushings. Works nicely, just a little extra work.

You can see we decided to do our leg bracing a little differently. The Legs themselves are 4"x4". Then we used 2"x2" to make the horizontal pieces. We did not use any diagonal braces so we could store stuff underneath if we needed to.

Scot was working on the stops when I left last night.

We have the Motors, Gecko 203vs, 48v power supply, pmdx 122 on the way. Still looking for/pricing wiring. Still having fun!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg y car.jpg (51.8 KB, 2755 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0379_1024x682.jpg (39.3 KB, 2742 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0371_1024x682.jpg (42.0 KB, 2732 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0384_640x426.jpg (47.0 KB, 2694 views)

Last edited by cmd1991; Wed 12 May 2010 at 16:10..
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  #5  
Old Fri 14 May 2010, 15:59
Codered741
Just call me: Cody
 
Lancaster (Pennsylvania)
United States of America
Eccentrics

The Gantry and Y-Car dont use the eccentric bushings. Just an M12 bolt through side plate and the bearing, with shims to make it ride right.

See M1 20 100AB

-Cody
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  #6  
Old Sat 15 May 2010, 15:00
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Hmm, okay guess we missed that.

I'm currently working on the control box design. Can somebody please tell me if I'm thinking right on the e-stops and limit switches? I'm currently thinking I can use N/O (closed when depressed) roller arm limit switches underneath the gantry and Y car. They will roll along the track until they hit the hole we drilled for proximity switches. This way, if anything derails the will act as stop switches also. I am guessing I can add a push button e-stop (mounted on the side of the gantry) in series with these limit switches too? Am I thinking correctly?

Last edited by cmd1991; Sat 15 May 2010 at 15:21..
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  #7  
Old Sat 15 May 2010, 15:22
Regnar
Just call me: Russell #69
 
Mobile, Alabama
United States of America
Collin, I don't think that the Roller Switch will last very long rolling back and forth. I dont even think they would last a week especially when the dust started getting into them.

You should really read this thread http://mechmate.com/forums/showthread.php?t=584

I want to say the whole proximity part of the system cost less than 125.00

The plans call for 3 estops and again I want to say less than 40 bucks for all of them. If you haven't check out FactoryMation you might want to.

You can live without the limits but I wouldn't get rid of estops. When spending the money just think ease and convenience and safety.
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  #8  
Old Sat 15 May 2010, 19:13
Codered741
Just call me: Cody
 
Lancaster (Pennsylvania)
United States of America
limits and E-Stop

I wouldn't wire the limits and the E-Stop in series, they don't do the same thing!

The limits are used for both homing and derailing, while e-stop kills power to everything in an emergency situation. the way you are proposing, you could trigger a homing sequence, have an emergency, hit the e-stop and Mach would think it hit a limit and reverse trying to get off of it! NOT what you want to happen when you hit the big red button!!!

OR

If you wired the limits in the e-stop circuit, every-time you hit a limit, it shuts off your machine. Not good either.

The PMDX has an input for e-stop, as well as limits. IMHO its best to follow the plans in this department. Wire the E-stop buttons in series to close a contactor, and have one contact close the e-stop circuit. Proxes and relays work great, but mechanical switches do too. Just make sure you get good ones, not the cheesy micro switches. AND you would want N/O switches, so when the gantry jumps/hits limit/wire gets ripped out, the machine stops.

Looks good! What are you using for leveling feet? Are they just bolts?

-Cody

Last edited by Codered741; Sat 15 May 2010 at 19:21..
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  #9  
Old Sun 16 May 2010, 19:56
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Thanks guys!
Yes they are 7/8 fine thread bolts. We're still working on the rubber feet.
I think I'm getting a better idea of how this works now. I thought that the limit switches would turn the machine off. I am thinking I will use 2 limit/homing on one end of the X axis (for squaring), one on the opposite end, one on each end of the Y axis, and a touchplate for the Z. Then I will have the e-stops on a second input on the breakout board. Maybe dpst e-stop switches. One pole for the Main power, and one for the breakout board.

Last edited by cmd1991; Sun 16 May 2010 at 20:20..
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  #10  
Old Sun 16 May 2010, 20:44
Codered741
Just call me: Cody
 
Lancaster (Pennsylvania)
United States of America
why not proxes?

do you have something against the proximity switches? They are a tried and true solution, and are really easy to implement.

Just wondering.

And limits will stop the machine, but just in the software. E-Stop should kill the power to the machine, usually through a relay.

IMHO you dont really need to have rubber feet, we are using 3/4" carriage bolts on our table, and they work great!

-Cody
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  #11  
Old Sun 16 May 2010, 23:19
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
The rubber feet are only needed if you have a noise problem through the floor. I don't think that many people have their other shop equipment (bandsaw, table saw, planer, etc.) on rubber feet.

Solid bolting to concrete would probably be the best.
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  #12  
Old Tue 18 May 2010, 19:55
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Thanks for all the info guys!

Quick update.
I found a control box from a friend. Yayy! Needs a little touchup, but it was a good price, and he also had the din terminals. I ordered my proximity switches, e-stops, power switch, router relay, etc. I hooked up the breakout board with my demo of mach, and was able to figure out that it DOES work.

Also ordered the Z plate steel, gas shock, as well as some misc nuts and bolts.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg control box before_640x480.jpg (64.7 KB, 2530 views)
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  #13  
Old Tue 18 May 2010, 19:59
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
I thought I would give you some pictures of Scot's truck to drool over until next time. He will have to give you the details.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0394_640x426.jpg (46.3 KB, 2516 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0391_320x480.jpg (30.8 KB, 2492 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0389_640x426.jpg (49.7 KB, 2490 views)
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  #14  
Old Wed 19 May 2010, 00:32
Alan_c
Just call me: Alan (#11)
 
Cape Town (Western Cape)
South Africa
Send a message via Skype™ to Alan_c
Wow, '48 Chev, I used to have a Crimson Red one about 20 years ago with a 4.1L straight six - then I got married...(no, not her demand, we needed the money)
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  #15  
Old Wed 19 May 2010, 01:20
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Lovely lovely piece....
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  #16  
Old Wed 19 May 2010, 09:59
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Saving $300

Sandblasting the supply box for mechmate.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg sandbox.jpg (36.3 KB, 2449 views)
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  #17  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 08:07
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
More Pictures

Okay, I've got some more pictures.

The Beast is now Painted Mechmate Red!!!! (along with the driveway and my pants and shoes)

It turned out very nice.

We ordered a Milwaukee 3 1/2 hp router from amazon.com
Scot was modifying the base for it yesterday.

I was able to get the edges ground on the z plate yesterday also.
I bought a 7" blade from Harbour Freight and used the table saw method.
Worked very nicely.

Now I will be concentrating on what to use as an alternative cable carrier.
I am thinking about using 2" flexible drain pipe, and using 3" pvc cut in half as a trough for a shelf. I might use a piece of metal tape fastened to the tube to keep it straight. Any ideas?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg painted table.jpg (68.2 KB, 2354 views)
File Type: jpg painted y car.jpg (75.1 KB, 2345 views)
File Type: jpg trimming router base.jpg (79.0 KB, 2336 views)
File Type: jpg grinding z.jpg (55.8 KB, 2328 views)
File Type: jpg motor mounted.jpg (39.2 KB, 2314 views)
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  #18  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 08:20
Kobus_Joubert
Just call me: Kobus #6
 
Riversdale Western Cape
South Africa
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What sprocket is on that stepper on the last photo ?
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  #19  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 08:31
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
There are actually three sprockets.
One on the motor, and two idle sprockets.
Our machine is going to be chain driven. except on the Z axis.
The chain will be fastened on each end, and the motor will pull the gantry and car.
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  #20  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 12:23
domino11
Just call me: Heath
 
Cornwall, Ontario
Canada
OK this will be the first chain drive. What resolution will you have in the end?

Also did you weld or bolt on your cross bearers to the table tubing?
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  #21  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 12:42
Kobus_Joubert
Just call me: Kobus #6
 
Riversdale Western Cape
South Africa
Send a message via Yahoo to Kobus_Joubert Send a message via Skype™ to Kobus_Joubert
I don't understand most of this mechanical designs, but won't this chain system have a lot of play / backlash / start-stop delay or whatever they call it.

Second question... on the other photo it looks like you are putting the90 deg angle on the plate by GRINDING it against that abrasive wheel. What happens if that wheel gets smaller and smaller ? Just asking and maybe preventing you from throwing a piece of steel away if it is not working out.

Last edited by Kobus_Joubert; Wed 02 June 2010 at 12:45..
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  #22  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 13:28
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Domino11:
It is #35 chain and we have a 10 tooth sprocket on the stepper. I calculated 533.33 steps per inch. Not the best resolution, but should be good to start with on cabinet parts. We may add a gear reduction later.

We welded our cross bearers.




Kobus_Joubert:
We are hoping there won't be too much backlash. The chain will have tension and will be fastened to bolts at each end so we can adjust it.

I was surprised with the blade I used for grinding the Z plate.
I thought it was shrinking, but when I was done, There was very little difference between the old and new blade.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg blades.jpg (75.0 KB, 2300 views)
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  #23  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 17:40
smreish
Just call me: Sean - #5, 28, 58 and others
 
Orlando, Florida
United States of America
...The chain drive should give you pretty good performance. The only challenge I can think of is your capturing the v-groove wheels and the "drive" pretty well. You most likely will not derail if you have a bit or other similar failure. You may find your going to break something if your not extra vigilant. Otherwise - awesome idea with inexpensive parts.
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  #24  
Old Wed 02 June 2010, 23:36
Kobus_Joubert
Just call me: Kobus #6
 
Riversdale Western Cape
South Africa
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Thanks Collin, I thought that it will wear quickly and then your angle will not be 100%. But it worked and that is all that count's
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  #25  
Old Thu 03 June 2010, 07:14
J.R. Hatcher
Just call me: J.R. #4
 
Wilmington, North Carolina
United States of America
Send a message via Skype™ to J.R. Hatcher
Colin I would grind the sprocket so it doesn't protrude through the chain and can bottom out on the roller. Then allow the chain to lay right against the bottom of the rail and spring load the motor as normal. I can't see a lot of wear or backlash this way. I have been a cabinet maker for 40 years and I don't see any problems with accuracy of cut parts using this setup. The first Shopbots were chain driven.
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  #26  
Old Thu 03 June 2010, 08:35
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
I have considered that.
However, I thought that wrapping the chain around 1/2 of the drive sprocket (with idler sprockets) Would give it more contact area since it is such a small sprocket.
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  #27  
Old Fri 04 June 2010, 19:11
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Thanks everyone for the helpful input.
Here is a picture of the z axis and the router base.

We built our router mount based on Cordell's design here http://mechmate.com/forums/showthrea...ight=milwaukee

Hopefull I can get a lot of work done on the control box tommorrow.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg z axis.jpg (56.2 KB, 2225 views)
File Type: jpg router bracket.jpg (60.4 KB, 2215 views)
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  #28  
Old Sat 05 June 2010, 05:46
AuS MaDDoG
Just call me: Tony #71
 
Brisbane
Australia
Hi Guys!!

I may have missed it, but are you going to weld any bracing into your table?
You might get some movement with mommentum once old MM gets going

Cheers & good luck with the build.

Tony.
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  #29  
Old Tue 08 June 2010, 09:06
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Well, we used 3" tubing for our legs with 2" bracing around the bottom. It feels really sturdy. We were not planning on adding any diagonal bracing. I guess we will just have to keep an eye on it.
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  #30  
Old Sun 20 June 2010, 19:47
cmd1991
Just call me: Collin
 
New Haven, IN
United States of America
Here come the pictures!

First, is a general layout of the control box.
I found a power supply for a server that outputs 48v 19amps. It looks good and it even has a fan built into the end! I also found a nice 12v power supply at a garage sale.

Scot made a nice aluminum standoff for the gecko drives, and breakout board.

The next two pictures show the z assembly.
The only problem we noticed was the shock rubs on the spider plate. Has anybody else had this problem? Maybe our shock has a larger diameter.

More pictures soon.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg control panel.jpg (41.4 KB, 2067 views)
File Type: jpg spyder back.jpg (43.7 KB, 2065 views)
File Type: jpg spyder front.jpg (38.4 KB, 2053 views)
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