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  #31  
Old Mon 21 December 2009, 03:34
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Stan the trailor connectors have a lock together system built into them. If they pull apart then something major just happened.
The tines on the plug are large so they look really capable
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  #32  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 21:27
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Cutting the rails....

See pics for everyones enjoyment. I've found out what other MMers already knew .... cutting the rails is boring....

I've found something more boring....

Watching my build buddy Ted cut the rails....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg channel table.jpg (44.0 KB, 1394 views)
File Type: jpg channel table2.jpg (52.9 KB, 1401 views)
File Type: jpg ted cutting.jpg (50.4 KB, 1401 views)
File Type: jpg cut example.jpg (48.8 KB, 1396 views)
File Type: jpg ted skating.jpg (50.9 KB, 1401 views)
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  #33  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 21:28
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Notice "proper" treatment of Triumph (cover it up so no one knows its there)...

Ted covers his Triumph with blankets, I cover my MGB with crap...
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  #34  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 21:30
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Serious while Ted cut. I worked on the legs.... Plates will be (have been) moved to the rear of the channel between the webs to weld the cross braces on so that the table can be broken down.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg legs.jpg (32.4 KB, 1419 views)
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  #35  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 21:37
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Now for a rail cutting question...

One x-rail is beautiful, one isn't. The good one is nice and flat cut, the other is a bit wavy.

I think we pushed the cutting too fast using thin wheels.

My question is going to be hard to answer (because you can't see what I see), but here goes....

Would it be better to cut the rail again (with a thick disk) which would put the dimension closer to 1" (25.4 mm) and re-cut the other rail to match or just shim? The wavy is not really abrupt (maybe changes over a half-a-foot or so).

I guess the question is how much waviness can shimming deal with?
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  #36  
Old Fri 25 December 2009, 02:59
Claudiu
Just call me: Claus #43
 
Arad
Romania
Hi Stan,
If you consider the waves are in vertical direction you can use a grinding disk and go over it again and smooth it down, but take care not to cut down the rail under 25mm. otherwise many things change from the plans...if the dif. is not too much use shimming.
If the waves are lateral direction, you are going to use a gauge rod anyway to adjust perfect dimension between rails and you can fix it in place.
I guess best is to remeasure the rail and see what differences you have in height and judge after that what to do next.

Merry Christmas.
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  #37  
Old Fri 25 December 2009, 05:30
MetalHead
Just call me: Mike
 
Columbiana AL
United States of America
For the cost of it, I'd buy a new angle and redo the rail.
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  #38  
Old Fri 25 December 2009, 08:19
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Ah the 25mm question comes up again but this time a bit different.

I realize that going below 25mm as a minimum causes problems but what about the "maximum"? I read a post that mentioned that it really depends on the rack used (metric or inch) but didn't give me a number.....

Stan
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  #39  
Old Wed 30 December 2009, 10:33
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
Stan, your angle iron may have quite a big fillet radius in the inside, leaving only a little bit of vertical surface for the skate rollers to "grip" on when doing the bevel . . . . that is one of the dangers of going below the 25mm.

If you are using 30 tooth pinions you can make the rail a bit lower and the pinion will still engage properly with the rack, but you won't be easily able to use smaller 20 tooth pinions.
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  #40  
Old Wed 30 December 2009, 10:56
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
so if my math is correct....

no smaller than 25 mm which would be 0.98" and still use the smaller pinions?

I'm good then because the rail in question is around 1.1 ish.

Stan
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  #41  
Old Tue 23 February 2010, 10:49
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Well it has been a long time in getting to this point. The rail cutting and grinding isn't fun but it is doable.....

Our (Ted and Stan) thoughts on grinding.... Ditch the bolt for height adjustment and go for a bearing... Adjust depth of cut (err. grind) by sliding plate with grinder (in/out, angle). Little to no glazing of wheels, cut much faster.

I'll see if I can get some pics up later (per my schedule probably next month).

Onto to the table....

long beams cut, cross bearers cut, both drilled (we're doing a bolt together table).... We may have to weld later, but the machine is being built in one location to be moved to another location later.....

Stan
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  #42  
Old Tue 23 February 2010, 22:48
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
I agree the bearing is the way, but the height adjustment system needs work.
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  #43  
Old Thu 25 February 2010, 09:10
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
moving forward in Littleton

Yep, but consider that the first ones were built w/o the skate, we are making progress.

What Ted and I found was that the height adjustment is not all that much of an issue because we twisted the grinder plate (looking down at the top of the skate) a bit to get a bigger/better bite on the grinder wheel. We drilled a new hole on the grinder plate in the arc that the slot (older skate drawings) circumscribed.

Before that we'd glaze up a wheel in just a few passes. It took us HOURS to get the first rail to passable. The other three took less time combined than the first.

It may have been the infamous "learning curve" but I don't think so.
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  #44  
Old Thu 25 February 2010, 21:43
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Stan, Some time ago, Joe (jehayes) told me grinding the rails is the rite of passage. Now you had earned it, Congrats.

This IMHO is the most laborious & messy part of the build, it took me 3~4 full working day to have them done. (To me the Kitchen table project comes next on the list).
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  #45  
Old Thu 25 February 2010, 22:35
jehayes
Just call me: Joe #53
 
Whidbey Island, Washington
United States of America
I actually found the kitchen table project more daunting because electricity scares the s**t out of me!

Congratulations on getting over the rail grinding hump. It's all smooth sailing downhill from here!

Joe
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  #46  
Old Thu 25 February 2010, 22:43
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Quote:
Originally Posted by jehayes View Post

because electricity scares the s**t out of me!

Joe
That makes at least 2 of us
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  #47  
Old Fri 26 February 2010, 05:57
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Boy I hope so as I was "fearing" the rail grinding. Even though I had been lurking around here for a year or so, I didn't really think it would work (even though there were pics to prove).

Finally, I (we) just had to do it. For me the "kitchen table" project is less daunting as I have built several cnc machines (foam cutters, a small table cnc router w/ ac servos, even a laser cutter) so this part of the build is much less scary.

At this point the thing that I dread (not scared) is drilling/taping all the holes, and then the paint (I'm not a ford guy ;-)

For those that are a bit timid on the kitchen table/control system, just be patient and OCD (ok anal) about the connections (double check, and then check again). The idea of doing the control cabinet as a kitchen table project helps one to focus on the smaller picture for a moment. I'm not sure anyone has mentioned this but theoretically the control box could be moved with a bit of fuss to a small mill/lathe. There is nothing "mechmate" specific about the control system other than Gerald et. al. good choice in components.

Stan
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  #48  
Old Fri 26 February 2010, 06:30
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Stan,
Drill tap is less dreadful if you treat it as dynamic meditation like I did. Don't forget to prepare suitable lubricant for both drilling & tapping, I used WD40 as that was the only "oil" in the shop at that time, I would use cooking oil if I have too
Like many others, paint before fully assemble is what I did, it sure saved me from some serious yoga exercise & weight lifting. It turn out quite a bit of fun for me too. (I hand paint with roller brush, used up 2 pint of top coat (3 coats) without dilution for 1220x4400 table)
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  #49  
Old Sun 28 February 2010, 00:04
swatkins
Just call me: Steve
 
Houston
United States of America
Hi Stan.

About 20 years ago I felt the same way about taping holes.. I would have rather used nuts than tap a hole. THEN I found the right tools!

tap.jpg

I was out in the shop and just finished taping a few holes when I read this post so I gathered up a few items and took this picture.. This is the secret to easy taping! First off you need a set of SPIRAL POINT Taps... These suckers cut metal like hot butter and push the metal out in front of the tap so you do not have to make a turn and then back up... With a spiral point tap you just start twisting and don't look back... They are so good that I hardly ever put one in a tap wrench and instead stick them in a power drill... Takes me about 30 seconds to tap almost any size hole!

The next item you need is something to keep the tap square to the hole as you perform the operation.. Years ago a friend made the Tap Guide you see in the picture... .750" thick aluminium with all the tap sizes drilled through ( well almost all, you see he forgot one ) ... Easy to make and use...

The last item is a good cutting fluid.. The can on the right is for aluminium and is easily found. The Jug on the left is the very last of my supply of Tap Heavy This stuff is the best I have ever used and I have not found any in the last 5 years.. It's made by Trim and is a thick, sticky fluid.. It makes drilling holes a pleasure even with a hand drill... I have had that jug for about 15 years and would kill for a new one!

If you pick up a few taps and give them a try I promise you'll never dread another tap again


UPDATE :

After posting this message I got to thinking about my serious shortage of Tap Heavy and went searching on the internet... I FOUND THE COMPANY !!!! It is now being made by Master Chemical and here is a link to their product pages... As soon as some of their distributors open Monday morning I will be on the telephone! Oh Happy Days

Last edited by swatkins; Sun 28 February 2010 at 00:30..
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  #50  
Old Sun 28 February 2010, 04:35
Robert M
Just call me: Robert
 
Lac-Brome, Qc
Canada
Send a message via Yahoo to Robert M Send a message via Skype™ to Robert M
I have had that jug for about 15 years and would kill for a new one!

UPDATE :

After posting this message I got to thinking about my serious shortage of Tap Heavy and went searching on the internet... I FOUND THE COMPANY !!!!


Steve, we're all happy to see know that the world is a safer place to be thanks to this this "new supplyer" !

Robert
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  #51  
Old Sun 28 February 2010, 18:59
swatkins
Just call me: Steve
 
Houston
United States of America
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert M View Post
Steve, we're all happy to see know that the world is a safer place to be thanks to this this "new supplyer" !

Robert
Yes, you can all rest easier tonight
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  #52  
Old Mon 01 March 2010, 07:02
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Ok I promised pics....

This set is the mods (VERY CRUDE) to the skate.... Worked a whole lot better. I believe the "newer" skate plates are drawn with the possiblity of using bearings front/rear....

Height adjust may not make sense but it works by twisting the wheel into the rail as opposed to up/down.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg skate bearing.jpg (48.3 KB, 1073 views)
File Type: jpg skate bottom.jpg (57.5 KB, 1073 views)
File Type: jpg skate new hole.jpg (68.8 KB, 1069 views)
File Type: jpg skate adjust.jpg (50.0 KB, 1073 views)
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  #53  
Old Mon 01 March 2010, 07:05
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
still more pics....

some of the drilling...

We are making a portable MM Yeah, right! It is a beast even now. It will be moved to its next home after painting..
Attached Images
File Type: jpg xbearer drilled.jpg (56.6 KB, 1079 views)
File Type: jpg long beam drilled.jpg (52.6 KB, 1077 views)
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  #54  
Old Mon 01 March 2010, 07:09
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
last pic....

We've got the frame basically assembled. I took a pic before the legs went on and bracing... Got to get those pics....

As for size. This was where Ted's TR3 sat including the oil puddle (couldn't resist that one). Makes one think about sitting on the gantry on a machine that is built in a garage that is bigger/heavier than a TR3....

I just couldn't convice Ted to build the table and park the TR3 underneath.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg frame no legs.jpg (56.6 KB, 1080 views)
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  #55  
Old Mon 01 March 2010, 11:36
swatkins
Just call me: Steve
 
Houston
United States of America
Stan how easy was it to make the height adjustments with your skate ?
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  #56  
Old Tue 02 March 2010, 04:29
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
Adjusting the depth was a piece of cake... Put the skate on the rail, loosen the pivot bolt a bit (the one with the nut welded on), loosen the bolt that sits on the arc a little more, press the plate till the wheel lightly touches the rail, tighten, turn wheel to make sure did not go too deep (should rotate with drag).

Grind both sides of rail...

Next adjustment is same way....

You can take as much/little as you want. We also used a very light tap by a hammer on the plate when getting close.
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  #57  
Old Tue 02 March 2010, 16:19
crashingsucks
Just call me: doc #67
 
NC
United States of America
Thats right! No real height adjustment, Just a twisting movement into the beam. The old way the grinding disk would become glazed over. I have always used angle grinders on a angle. So this way you can really make a aggressive cut. When I got close to the finished dimension, I switched to a new disk and then made lighter cuts. If done the old way, well I was going to kill something!!!!! This way I would even cut rails for friends. Not bad at all.

Last edited by crashingsucks; Tue 02 March 2010 at 16:22..
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  #58  
Old Sun 14 March 2010, 20:30
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
update...table framed...

finally through the "dead bug" stage.....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg leg.jpg (88.0 KB, 946 views)
File Type: jpg side frame.jpg (74.9 KB, 943 views)
File Type: jpg table upside down1.jpg (77.2 KB, 938 views)
File Type: jpg ready to stand.jpg (68.2 KB, 951 views)
File Type: jpg size reference.jpg (73.7 KB, 952 views)
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  #59  
Old Sun 14 March 2010, 20:31
salewis
Just call me: Stan #67
 
Littleton, NC
United States of America
I was (we were)..... Framed....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg table right side up.jpg (69.1 KB, 957 views)
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  #60  
Old Sun 14 March 2010, 20:48
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Stan, I see you enjoy playing trampoline with the table! Good progress, the hard work is over. The works will be a breeze from here on.
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