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  #31  
Old Fri 20 November 2009, 08:25
Richards
Just call me: Mike
 
South Jordan, UT
United States of America
If all cables have a foil shield with a bare drain wire outside the shield, and if all drain wires have ONE end connected to a common ground lug, then you will have the least amount of electrical interference without adding extra parts and pieces.
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  #32  
Old Fri 20 November 2009, 11:28
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
There is a cheap alternative for shielding - - - - create distance between the cables. If you have wide cable carriers, you can get away with running unshielded motor & router cables along one side and then running signal cables about 3" away along the other side. But I don't like the look of wide cable carriers with nearly nothing in them.
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  #33  
Old Sun 22 November 2009, 20:13
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
OK, cable is sorted and filtering will be sufficient I think. Will have all motor drives shielded and the control box mounted to the machine to reduce cable length.

My next big problem is locating the MM. I need space, my garage allows for a 1 foot clearance around the outside of the proposed machine! So to all you MM's in Melbourne, If you have any spare warehouse room, let me know!
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  #34  
Old Mon 30 November 2009, 17:21
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Brad, if it's something I know it's insurance! When I was a practicing engineer I would always wonder at the balance in "Factors of Safety" and economical design. I then moves industry and found the true meaning of "Factors of Safety" when I had to confront on a daily basis when the situation has surpassed the FOS.
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  #35  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 12:17
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Yet again I have been confronted with the madness of retail sales in Australia. I have been looking for a steel supplier and sort 3 quotes from companies who had assured me they were the companies to purchase from. One said they had a history in the industry, one specialised in supplying to retail and one was very local ( I could almost hit them with a thrown stone). When the quotes came in, the price from the retail specialist was twice the cost of the others. I called him and suggested they have another look at it as I could source it at half the price. They told me to go away. Well I be placing my ordered from the cheapest supplier who is furthest and does not charge for delivery (amortised in material cost). Funny that the closest one was competitive on steel pricing but charged almost 10% of the total cost for delivery. Looking at my supplier chart for my MM build reveals a tale of make or break. If I had been quoted $14K to build a MM then it would never happen. Yet with a firm resolve to work hard to save the costs of construction I have it at $7K without any degrading of design. I have to thank the MM community for much of the saving and look forward to getting started on the build soon.
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  #36  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 21:56
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
We have a joke among my friends,
Double the price and you have a very "special" offer, specially for you

Specialist are not always good business person, so, when doing business, its best to stick with business man.

There are companies whom offer no frill services, hence, low selling price, delivery is an additional service in the world of "no-frill" business. They actually expect you to arrange for collection if you really mean to reduce cost... Another rational business strategy to keep the business afloat...
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  #37  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 22:20
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
SPIDER PLATE WARNING!!! Just found out some critical build news. The spider plate has etch marks for potential mounting points for the Z plate bearings. The drawing suggests 132mm but in fact it's more like 140mm. I would suggest grinding your Z plate first then marry up the bearings and measure the required hole centres. While this has been noted in other builds it's not on the drawings, so many seem to have had to weld up the holes and redrill that it's an issue.
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  #38  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 22:35
Gerald D
Just call me: Gerald (retired)
 
Cape Town
South Africa
Drawing 10 40 432 D says:

(132[5.2"]) approx - TO SUIT SLIDE & V-ROLLERS

And then there is a thread: Spider Plate Oh-Oh!! (which # mark to drill on?)
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  #39  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 23:08
ffej
Just call me: ffej
 
Geelong
Australia
Hello Besser
I'm in the industry (I build electrical stuff) and have noticed that most businesses (and tradies) are opportunistic, they charge a lot more if they think you're desperate, in a hurry or have nowhere else to go.
Most see retail customers as sheep, ready for shearing.
The only way to get the lower prices and better delivery is to become a long term income stream, then they'll bend over backwards to keep you.
Perhaps a business name and requests for quotations via email would get a better response.

I know this doesn't help. But it may be a consolation that you're not the only one getting this treatment.
Ffej
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  #40  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 23:28
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
I agree, it is too easy to advertise yourself as "the sheep" when you use terms written on textbooks or catalog. Invest some time to learn up a few local trade jargon before approaching potential supplier for quotation. portrait as a "player", once they believe you are potential "mainstream" customer, you will get good treatment.
Anyway this is another side of any project undertaking which I enjoy immensely.
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  #41  
Old Mon 07 December 2009, 23:44
Claudiu
Just call me: Claus #43
 
Arad
Romania
I can only agree with that.
I also do requests for quotations, not only through the business but I also use a socalled purchase department. After several emails, and requesting certificates of quality, tech. data or security sheets for the products, the vendor has to qualify and that he is eligible for doing business with my company. Then we talk about money with big discounts weather we do procurement as a reseller or producer...

What Ken said about the special price made to friends is absolutely true...

Greetings
Claus
Of course this is not valid if you buy one geckodrive or 10 screws...
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  #42  
Old Tue 08 December 2009, 03:24
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
My route is slightly different, I'll put on my "small-time-one-man-show-contractor" attire, or wear a collared T-shirt or jump-suit with some company logo printed, with a pair of worn safety boots. Walk into some crowded hardware store & throw a few jargon around and ask for a quote inclusive of delivery, term-cash. the price difference would be within 5% & if it exceeds, that means the jargon were wrongly applied...
Same applies to machine shops, laser cut... etc etc... I don't even need to ask for quantity discount.
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  #43  
Old Thu 10 December 2009, 20:48
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Guys you are all showing me I have to haggle my way through for which I have done. What gets my goat up is the short sightedness of over charging. In an era of marketing by referal, there are plenty of companies who dont have favour with me and the dissapointing thing is many are Australian companies.
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  #44  
Old Thu 10 December 2009, 21:01
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Have to tell you this one.

Big company selling ply and MDF has show room with "Trade" Price list on counter. I look at list and see their pricing is higher then a chain retail outlet. I ask him to confirm A: they commonly sell to public B: what their best discount price is for 4 sheets. They tell me they always sell to public and I'm lucky to get Trade price even on 4 sheets. I let him know (nicely) his pricing is to high. He doesnt budge, I walk and will always peg them as a "ripoff merchant" I call on another supplier I was referred to 6 years ago and guess what! Their pricing policy still stands. They sell as if they want every customer who walks in to buy from them. The end of story is I saved 32.5%, I wish my bank savings grew at 32.5%

I seem to grumble in this tread some so here is a shout out. Melbourne Australia----- "Tile Importers" -------- bloody sharp pricing every day.
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  #45  
Old Thu 10 December 2009, 21:03
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Well Guys I'm now moving to the construction started Phase!

HERE WE GO
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  #46  
Old Thu 10 December 2009, 21:09
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
OK, Over recent times I have looked, listened, lurked and purchased, Now is the time to build. I will officially cut steel today and start the process. I have had great fun being a virtual MM participant and now I'll get my hands dirty (and bloody)
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  #47  
Old Thu 10 December 2009, 22:56
ffej
Just call me: ffej
 
Geelong
Australia
The trade price is a scam for the retail mugs, for example, I've seen plumbing supplies charged to the tradie, at 90% off the trade price.
Other scams are the free gift at the end of the month, the weekly prize, the 2 for 1 offer, the manufacturers rebate. Go to a trade show and see how often the big door prize is awarded to a favorite customer.
(Yes, I know I'm bitter and cynical it's just that I never win these prizes)

Still it must work in the suppliers favour or they wouldn't do it.
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  #48  
Old Wed 23 December 2009, 17:29
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
OK a quick update:

BIG thanks to Rick for the lend of his metal circular saw. Sliced the rails to size in 20min. also the base plate edge is 29.7mm from the kerf so it all worked easy!

Big thanks to Chris who turned up the next day will all the rail grinding gear setup ready to go!

Dont Laugh Yet! My control box is a suitcase!
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  #49  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 02:48
Claudiu
Just call me: Claus #43
 
Arad
Romania
Please post some pics of your evolution.
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  #50  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 03:07
aniljangra
Just call me: Anil #44
 
Delhi
India
Send a message via Skype™ to aniljangra
Quote:
Originally Posted by Besser View Post
OK a quick update:
Dont Laugh Yet! My control box is a suitcase!
I am also not able to decide if I post pics of my control box or not, as the maker made the box too big by mistake
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  #51  
Old Thu 24 December 2009, 04:32
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Besser, Anil,
Like real estate, over sized control box is an asset! You will have cooler temperature, less layout restrictions & luxury of organizing your wiring however you fancy. Last but not the least, you will be smiling when you decided to upgrade your electronics & control.
Merry x'mas
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  #52  
Old Fri 25 December 2009, 20:22
Sherman McCoy
Just call me: "Krasch"
 
Portland,OR
United States of America
In the USA, we always say, "bigger is better". My box is 20"x20"x10". Its big enough, I may strip the MOBO & HDD out of my PC and mount it in the box, strap a screen on top, and just hang the keyboard off the side!
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  #53  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 03:25
sailfl
Just call me: Nils #12
 
Winter Park, FL
United States of America
Krasch,

That is a nice size box but mine (if you are bragging) is 30"x20"x8". I like having a large enough space to work. It is a bit big but there is plenty room and it stays cool with the fan setup like the plans.

I know others put their computer inside the box but I don't like the extra heat in there. My box is at the rear of the table while my computer is at the front, 0,0 of the table.
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  #54  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 05:09
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Control Box

Ok here are some Photos.

Like I said it's a Breifcase, it is to be moved between several machines pending which will be doing the work. It's half way there.


This is the plug outs for drives, usb, 1x220VAC I have another 15 pins in this plugset free.


Other side is the Power in, 3x220VAC out from VFD, USB


Front Panel, need more buttons and custom filter sys


THE GUTS! Still needs SS+BOB, wiring, Baffeling for air flow and shielding



Now you can Laugh!

Last edited by Besser; Sat 26 December 2009 at 05:12..
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  #55  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 05:28
KenC
Just call me: Ken
 
Klang
Malaysia
Love it!
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  #56  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 08:08
jessyjames
Just call me: James
 
Reno, Nevada
United States of America
Pretty neat indeed. I have only one suggestion.... "Do not bring that with you on an airplane"..

It could get a little hairy for you buddy.

GJ
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  #57  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 11:57
Claudiu
Just call me: Claus #43
 
Arad
Romania
Great design, recycling is everything...
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  #58  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 16:43
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Yeah a plane trip may be trouble....the flux capacitor.... may interfere with the avionics.

Claus: I am recycling as much as possible and using common parts as well.

Coolant pump and radiator, air filter will be automotive "just something I had lying around"
Table Legs:"just something I had lying around"
Table Feet: "just something I had lying around"
Control Boxes:"just something I had lying around"
Sensors: "just something I had lying around" reversing sensors (will be fun configuring them)
Springs:"just something I had lying around" old mattress base springs
Turnbuckles for springs: "just something I had lying around"

The list goes on...
Sometimes I get more enjoyment thinking laterally then spending cash (sometimes)
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  #59  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 16:57
sailfl
Just call me: Nils #12
 
Winter Park, FL
United States of America
Besser,

You make you MM so it will fit in a large suite case????

Interesting idea.
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  #60  
Old Sat 26 December 2009, 17:06
Besser
Just call me: Besser
 
Vic
Australia
Don't know if I have a 15foot by 7foot case hanging around! I'd have to put the handles on the bottom.
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